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The Next Time Somebody Tells You America Is A “Center-Right Country”…

Posted by Phoenix Woman on November 9, 2008

…show them this:


Takes your breath away, doesn’t it?

UPDATE: I guess a little explanation is needed here.

See, the Cons and their tame media allies are busy using the bogus “America is a center-right country” theme (along with lies about Roosevelt’s record and the New Deal) to try and cow the Democrats from acting on their renewed mandate. But as the data show, the Cons are lying through their teeth and gums on this. If the Democrats ignore the Cons and the rest of the GOP/Media Complex, they’ll do just fine.

10 Responses to “The Next Time Somebody Tells You America Is A “Center-Right Country”…”

  1. Stormcrow said

    Sorry, PW, but that graph does not and cannot address the politics behind the party affiliation.

    So what it tells us about the “Center-Right” hypothesis is zero.

  2. Charles II said

    It shows a clear trend of the young voting for Democrats. The question is whether that first impulse will translate into a lifetime habit, but it’s a move in the right direction. It would seem to suggest that the future belongs to the Democrats Even considering some of the trogs in the Party, I wouldn’t call them center right. Armadillo centrists, perhaps.

  3. Stormcrow said

    No, actually, the graph PW reprinted here doesn’t show that.

    That graph just shows Democrat versus Republican.

    The graph that supports your contention is the one she didn’t post here.

    But even that one, and the article behind the link PW gave us, says nothing about the “Center-Right” hypothesis, only the growing Democratic support among the population on the 18-29 age bracket.

    Unfortunately, “Democrat” != “Liberal”. As entirely too many Blue Dogs have shown us over the course of the last 8 wretched years.

  4. Actually, Stormie, the people saying that “America is a center-right country” aren’t comparing it to other countries, but to internal politics. They’re using that line to tell Obama “Don’t you DARE try acting as if you have a mandate!” when he most clearly does, especially with younger voters.

  5. MEC said

    Given the people making the argument that “American is a center-right country”, I opine with confidence that what they really mean is “Americans may have voted a whole bunch of Republicans out of office, but they still want the Republican agenda.” They just won’t call it “the Republican agenda” because Republicans are so unpopular right now. Looking at actual party identification is a valid way to refute that argument: thanks to years of propaganda from Fox Noise and that ilk, few people identify “Democrat” with “rightwing” or even “center-right”.

    Granted, few people identify themselves as “liberal”, but that’s probably because “liberal” has been used as an insult for so long. If you ask people about specific agenda items, a majority of them support the “liberal” agenda (DemFromCT provides a data point in Daily Kos: a majority of poll respondents want government to do more, not less, and government “doing more” is a political-liberal concept these days.

  6. Charles II said

    Stormcrow, I stick with my statement that the charts show “a clear trend of the young voting for Democrats.” 48-54-60-66 makes a trend.

    With a bit more noise, this trend goes back to the last change election in 1980.

    I think you agree with me, since you observe “the growing Democratic support among the population on the 18-29 age bracket”

    Perhaps Democrats have gotten much more conservative in the last 16 years, such that there is no correlation between Democratic vote and liberalism. I just don’t see the evidence for that. More plausibly, Democrats have stayed about the same, and the right has become increasingly rabid and insane, so people are voting increasingly for sane candidate who may or may not be liberal. But if so, why haven’t other age groups followed this strong trend?

    Anyway, if you have evidence on which direction the political median has moved, I’d be delighted to see it.

  7. Stormcrow said

    Staring at the Future Majority web page again, I have to say that you may be right about the content of the first graph, Charles.

    But if so, then that graphic is flawed. It does not tell enough of the story to make the point its author wants to make.

    That first graph, this one, which PW cited, does NOT contain a legend stating that this is the 18-29 age group. The only way you’re going to see that is by comparison to the second graph.

    Look at it by clicking “View Image” in Firefox and you’ll see what I mean. The caption “Youth Vote (Ages 18-29) Support in Presidential Elections” belongs to the second graphic, not the first. But the dataset (including the restriction to the 18-29 age bracket) is apparently common to them both.

    But NEITHER graph speaks to the “center-right” hypothesis.

    Charles, I’m not arguing that your reading of the election is incorrect. I AM arguing that these graphs don’t show it. They show a shift in party affiliation, not the fundamental beliefs that underlie that affiliation.

    The piece at Future Majority was making a fairly limited point about Democratic/Republican allegiance among the 18-29 age group. It didn’t even try to address the larger issue of fundamental beliefs.

    But I am more dubious about that one, personally, than I am about the conclusions of the Future Majority piece.

    Clinton’s administration was center-right. That was how he won in 1996: he ran to the right of the Republicans. And that’s how he ran his government those last four years. I’m afraid the phrase “Overton Window” describes more than just media perceptions. The whole damn country has shifted, after 40 years of continuous bombardment, from every direction, with the memes propagated by what we’d call the Right, in 1967.

    Whether the Obama administration turns out to be left of center remains to be seen. Right now, I’m not very hopeful about that. We NEED a liberal administration. That doesn’t mean we’re going to get one.

  8. It’s likely that Clinton got in in 1992 thanks to Perot, who siphoned off a lot of the GOP’s support. He got re-elected in 1996 because of Oklahoma City the year before and the Gingrich-led government shutdown that followed a few months later; both events served to alert a portion of the American public to the dangers of right-wing nuttery, and as such served as a prelude to the anti-Clinton witchhunts that would mar the late 1990s. In short, he got lucky, a luck that didn’t extend to the Democrats in Congress or in the statehouses or governors’ mansions.

    This is why I’m glad that a follower of DLC/Blue-Doggy politics, Rahm Entourage – erm, Emanuel – has been kicked upstairs, going from head of the DCCC (and as such, the biggest enemy of Howard Dean’s Fifty-State Strategy) and a congressional fiefdom that was his for life, into a job that a) he can be fired from at any time, b) is so demanding that most CoSes are lucky to last two years, c) will put him into the meatgrinder crotch first the first time he screws up in public (and his titanic ego all but guarantees that), and d) will ultimately set back, if not kill outright, any further efforts at being a political kingmaker.

    And Stormie: Did you look at the OTHER links I’ve added?

  9. Charles II said

    The legend is missing, Stormcrow. One does, as you suggest, need to read the story behind the link to figure out that the graph is youth vote. And one set of figures certainly doesn’t prove that America is swinging left. However, I would argue that the futuremajority data are more consistent with a swing toward the left than the alternatives.

    As to whether Clinton was center right or center left, that’s a judgment that each of us must make. Clinton certainly did a number of things that are associated with conventional conservatism: balanced the budget, dumped people off welfare, privatized agencies, assisted media consolidation. But he also did a number of things that no conservative would want to touch with a 10-foot pole: raised taxes on the wealthy, Americorps, raised the minimum wage, installed a Sec. Labor who was a strong exponent of unions…. So, I think of Clinton as sui generis: a liberal forced to work under the oppressive thumb of a radically reactionary Congress. But YMMV.

  10. […] until the right rejoins the rest of the majority (our nation is left of center as a whole) and opens their minds again- breaking free of the propaganda they’ve fallen prey to, the […]

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